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Help with a Question on carnal dreams about ones spouse

May 30th, 2015

OK, stumped. Any ideas?

“Is it sinful to have carnal thoughts and dreams of your wife? If others were involved I think that is adultery, but only my wife are in them. We have been married almost 39 years and she is slowing down, me not so much.”

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    Ed Chait likes this.
  • Lea Ann Davis McCombs Why would this be wrong?
    May 29 at 8:14pm · Like
  • Tim White Dreaming? out of his control. Fantasizing? If she is slowed down it is just working himself up for temptations. That was my thinking, anyway.
    May 29 at 8:16pm · Like
  • Craig Simons I don’t believe so Tim.
    May 29 at 8:24pm · Like
  • Sarah Van Baale If his wife is slowing down, perhaps dreaming about her is an excellent compromise. I can’t imagine any wife being opposed to meeting her husbands needs in his dreams. Now if dreams become demands…that’s a different story. But truthfully, as people age, you have to give one other a bit of latitude. Everyone goes through stages of life when they are “out of sync” with their spouse – child bearing years, severe illnesses, aging, etc. It is part of life, and dreaming of your spouse seems like a wonderful compromise. I’d hope my husband would do the same. I can’t find a reason why it would be sinful unless it was consuming his life or causing him to make demands of his wife.
    May 29 at 8:27pm · Like · 3
  • Patrick Thompson not an easy question to answer. Of course the best place to start is the Word of God. In Song Of Solomon (not my favorite book), but nonetheless, part of the inspired Word of God, in chapter 3:1-4 it seems to be referring to the young woman dreaming night after night that she was searching for her lover but not finding him. We know that dreams can be significant, even though we might not understand them. Asking God for the understanding is always a good idea. Otherwise, we have 1st Cor. 7: as a significant guideline to the husband and wife’s sexual relations. Also, we can never go wrong to refer to Ephesians 5 and see our God-given roles to maintain in the marriage of love and submission.
    May 29 at 8:33pm · Like · 1
  • Patrick Thompson Tim, have you found a new church home yet? I’m still praying!
    May 29 at 8:34pm · Like · 1
  • Tim White Sarah, great points as usual. But dreaming and fantasizing do not meet a man’s needs, but has the opposite, intensifies them. Does that make a difference, in your thinking?
    May 29 at 9:01pm · Like · 1
  • Tim White Patrick, we go to Chama NM June 6th to preach in view of a call for pastor. up to now in the interview / reference stage, all looks promising.
    May 29 at 9:03pm · Like · 2
  • Sarah Van Baale Ironically, I just wrote an answer yesterday that said that same thing. Trying to satisfy our appetites in that manner, only increases the appetite, it doesn’t actually satisfy. Admittedly, I used a poor choice of words above. I didn’t mean to imply that dreaming actually met his needs. What I should have said is that if he is fantasizing about his wife in between the times that they are together as a way to give her some space, I see nothing wrong with that. In fact, it may increase his desire towards her and make their time together more fulfilling. I would be very careful not to criticize him for dreaming about his wife, because if he simply tries to suppress his desires all together, that will probably lead to a whole lot more trouble and temptation. God gave him a wife and they’ve been together for a long time. He shouldn’t be ashamed of his desire for her and personally, I think it is respectful that he does give her a little space as they are aging. Part of being a husband is caring for your spouse and recognizing her need to rest as well. Hopefully, they have a very solid relationship built on love and Christ and he feels close enough to share this with her – that he loves her, desires her, and dreams of her. He doesn’t need to go overboard and describe his dreams in detail, but I think it is really important that he shares with his wife how much he still loves her and is attracted to her especially if their sex life is slowing down. Who knows, just opening up to her and caring for her may ultimately increase her desire…but that should not be his motive.
    May 29 at 9:15pm · Like · 3
  • Marc Weiss Maybe I am in sin here, but if you are having dreams about your wife, and not someone else’s wife, another woman, etc. How could this even be sin? 1 Corinthians 7 speaks very clearly in verses 1-9 about this.

    If I am wrong, get up with me so I can repent.

    Dreaming about others is another discussion, but I am not going there here.
    May 30 at 1:04am · Edited · Like · 1
  • William Brenner Do you really have full responsibility for what you dream? If I kill an alien in a weird dream did I commit murder? The subconscience can reflect what we are like, but we do not make rational or particularly logical or moral decisions while asleep. I would not worry about dreams or take any of them too seriously.
    May 30 at 2:15am · Like · 2
  • Dale Agner An interesting word choice of “carnal” in relation to his wife/dreams. I view his question akin to a “needs maintenance” light coming on in the marriage. Not sin…but a dissonance of desires and emotions is currently being shared in the marriage. If the dissonance is not addressed, it often leads to a fractured marriage or sexual sin. Not an inappropriate time to consider counseling.
    May 30 at 2:27pm · Like · 1
  • Marc Weiss Right – I only addressed the sex part of the dream – but I agree, it could probably his needs not being met which is dangerous.
    May 30 at 2:29pm · Like · 1
  • William Brenner I dream about finding treasure. Has never paid off.
    May 30 at 3:04pm · Like · 1
  • Sarah Van Baale A couple of thoughts – I think he used the word carnal because he doesn’t want to use the word sex. Also, it is not a wife’s responsibility to meet all of his sexual “needs”. Look, we all have appetites, but just because his sexual appetite is bigger than his wife’s at this moment doesn’t mean they’re headed for doom. Life is an ebb and flow. He has a sexual desire, he has a wife to have sex with. Similarly he gets hungry for food and sometimes he gets to eat, other times he thinks about what he wants to eat and has to wait for the appropriate time. If he is advised that he should not dream about having sex with his wife and should just make her have sex with him instead, that is really dangerous and selfish. Submit one to another…not just the wife submit to the husband. He seems to feel uncomfortable with the idea that dreaming about sex with his wife is sinful, but I really don’t know how we could say that it is according to the Bible.

    Secondly, I do think we are held responsible for our dreams. It is my brain and my thoughts, and I take responsibility for them. I have even repented for some of the things I did in my dreams. Because if we are indulging in sin in our dreams, I think that highlights what is in our heart. I also solve complicated math problems in my dreams when I just can’t stay up any longer, and I take credit for solving them too.

    I really come away with the idea that he’s concerned he’s sinning, but he’s balancing his sexual desire with caring for his wife and considering her needs too. Unless I’m missing something, I’d give him a pat on the back and reassure him that as long as sexual thoughts are not consuming his life or causing him to act in a sinful way that dreaming about his wife while allowing her to rest is perfectly fine, and perhaps commendable. Spouses take care of one another. They should also speak to one another. If he isn’t talking to her…well, that would signal a problem.
    May 30 at 3:52pm · Like · 2
  • Tim White Thanks for everyone’s thoughts. I think in ingested them without indigestion. I was certain that there were angles that I was not getting, and, as always, you did. What a team!
    May 30 at 5:03pm · Unlike · 3
  • William Brenner Good points all, but I don’t think I control what goes on while dreaming. Dreams are influenced by what we think and do while awake. That is our responsibility. But it’s not a deliberate or controllable situation when you dream. Only a reflection and often a very distorted one or irrational one. The bible only refers to dreams when God chose to speak to someone in a dream. I think that ceased just as spiritual experiences like tongues ceased. There would be little to trust in someone today claiming that God told them something in a dream. If they did, we would justly be wary of them. Not based anywhere in scripture.
    May 30 at 7:37pm · Like · 1
  • Gwen Sellers Great response, Tim!
    May 30 at 8:14pm · Like · 1
  • Sarah Van Baale So William, what is the difference between day dreaming and dreaming at night? Are they not both our thoughts? Or do you think that we have no control over what we dream at night whereas we do during the day? I’m very hesitant to say that my thoughts in my brain at night are not my responsibility. I often fall asleep praying and probably pray somewhat into the going to sleep process. I hope God doesn’t disregard all my prayers after I’ve gotten too sleepy. And like I said before, my brain processes math problems while I sleep too. I think we’d have a hard time justifying the idea that we can’t sin in our thought life simply because we’re sleeping at the time.
    May 30 at 8:22pm · Like
  • Tim White My dreams must be different because in them I do things I would never would do by choice. During times when I experienced vulnerability, I dream I am naked and am terrified someone would notice. When I am in a period that I feel out of control, I dream I am driving a vehicle with failing brakes. A few nights ago, I dreamed I was Bruce Jenner and wondered which people would treat me like a lady (there was one moment in the dream when I wondered why in thunder was I doing this). That was after a day when I prayed for Bruce and all those so confused. In dreams, I step off ledges with the belief I can really fly. But maybe that’s just me.
    May 30 at 8:41pm · Like · 3
  • Marc Weiss Sarah – I know you asked William; but if I may just say this – on my behalf only (will let him speak for himself) – I think the difference is consciousness. I too fall asleep during prayer and I equate that to falling asleep with God. No sin there. Daydreaming is a conscious effort – we can stop that at any time – by “snapping out of it.” However, even if we look at the Old Testament, dreams were used by God to give visions. They had no control. By the same token, while not all dreams are from God or even Satan, we fight flesh as well (Ephesians 6). Therefore, our sinful flesh can take over at times in dreams too. I do not believe we can control dreams. While I think much of human science methods are junk (not the science itself as God created it), I think sleep studies are fairly accurate and show we just cannot help the subconscious. This is opinion and we can disagree and spend eternity discussing it in Heaven smile emoticon Just a view I have on this topic.
    May 30 at 8:44pm · Edited · Like · 2
  • Marc Weiss Let me just say though, if we act on a sinful type topic dream – while awake – then it is sin. So it can be dangerous, but in and of itself, I do not believe any dream is sin without action on our behalf. Hope this is clear in writing. OH and Romans 14 – if we think it is sin – we ask forgiveness and to not have those dreams.
    May 30 at 8:50pm · Edited · Like · 1
  • Sarah Van Baale In light of Tim’s response, I am convinced that we all dream differently! I suppose to each his own in this arena. My dreams are all fairly normal and almost always correspond to what is going on in life, which is why for me I feel as if my brain keeps running even though my body is sleeping. So, I take responsibility for my thoughts even when I’m asleep because I do feel that they highlight my heart. However, I can see how it would be different if dreams deviated that much from real life. I think if I dreamed I was Bruce Jenner, I would see this situation differently! smile emoticon
    May 30 at 8:54pm · Edited · Like · 4
  • William Brenner Yeah, my dreams often make no sense when I do remember them after waking up. And the vast majority of dreams are not even remembered moments after waking. So, I don’t think I can be responsible for my subconsious. It’s nothing like daydreaming which isn’t really dreaming at all, but using your imagination. And Tim…isn’t flying really fun! Even asleep I know it’s not real and I can’t fall. But at least I always wear a cape. It’s cold up there! Bruce Jenner? You must mean you dreamt that you were an Olympic swimmer.
    May 30 at 10:12pm · Like
  • Marc Weiss I dreamt I was a turtle
    23 hrs · Like · 1
  • William Brenner Must have been a slow week, Marc.

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