Tim White I agree with Brother Ed. Self-defense and chasing retribution are two different things. I did not like Falwell’s use of the sentence, “We will teach them a lesson if they come.” But I would have approached it that I can not “love one another” and do nothing as you are terrorized. I trust in God, but try to keep my powder dry anyway.

Wendyl Leslie Piper is wrong on this. Even Jesus made whips to beat off the enemies of God, and told His disciples to take their swords to defend themselves as they went from village to village to teach the gospel message. Read the book Nehemiah. There you’ll see Nehemiah arming his people to defend the walls of Jerusalem from those who opposed them. Thanks for opening the can, James. smile emoticon

William Brenner Piper is wrong and he entertains the wrong people these days. I will no longer listen to him.

James Toland Point 4 is the one that really blew my mind. In it he states that even calling 911 could be wrong. “4) I realize that even to call the police when threatened — which, in general, it seems right to do in view of Romans 13:1–4 — may come from a heart that is out of step with the mind of Christ. If one’s heart is controlled mainly by fear, or anger, or revenge, that sinful disposition may be expressed by using the police as well as taking up arms yourself.”

William Brenner The goverment needs no pastors to push their disarm-and-prepare-to-die mentality. The world has gone nuts and much of the church is getting sucked into the asylum.

Ambica Kissun Converse Sometimes I wonder what happens to the brains of those we once respected. God is definitely in control but it is like telling your child, no problem, God will take care of you so you can go and play in the streets. How can someone seriously think it is wrong to call 911 when one is in trouble…it just shows how liberal some of these men who call themselves pastors can be ignorant. Pray that God will open his eyes to see truth because he has not been making sense for many years now.

Evan Plante I’m somewhat old… and I’ve thought about this a bit… and here’s where I am: if you come after my grand-kids, you’re going down. I’ll let God sort us out afterwards.

Gina Cook As well meaning as he may be, I find I’m disagreeing a lot with Piper recently. Agreed Ambica Kissun Converse, the past few years he has fully embraced very questionable ideas. Protection and prevention can’t be confused with retaliation towards those that persecute us for being Christian. Someone coming in off the streets, not knowing or caring if we are Christian or not, but just wants to harm us or take our cash is different than persecution in the name of Christ. Calling the police only prevents others from being hurt by the same criminal, and that’s godly! We can’t protect the bad guys over other supposed lost people. I do believe though there is something to the message of “live by the sword die by the sword” that we need to seriously think about. I would rather it be for me, “live for Christ, die for Christ” than getting into gun fights just because I can. I think MacArthur explains self defense on that verse, what Piper mentions in the sword comment in #7, very well here:http://www.gty.org/…/table-talk-on-trouble-and-triumph…

Gina Cook here’s a link to a write-up someone did in response to Piper’s.http://www.aomin.org/…/01/i-beg-to-differ-brother-piper/

I Beg To Differ, Brother Piper – Alpha and Omega Ministries

This morning I was directed to a brief comment by…

AOMIN.ORG

Ambica Kissun Converse Praise God that JM has been consistent and we need to be in prayers for those who are still sound in their teaching. I am very blessed to be in such a church, our pastor definitely stays grounded. Gina Cook, great post and I love that series. Actually I am listening to Genesis 3 by JM now. Our Christian walk is when we die to self daily and strive to walk the walk and talk the talk. There is nothing wrong when we want to defend those we love. Believe me, I am very alert each Sunday or anytime we have service, we never know when one will get attack. I don’t have a gun but a mighty heavy purse.lol

Ambica Kissun Converse Will definitely read it. Thanks Gina Cook

Dale Agner I have studied why people make the decisions they have made, and Robert E Lee’s decision, as a Christian, to lead the Army of Virginia against the Union perplexed me. Historian David McCullough records that Lee had a difficult time making the decision, but decided in the end that he could not “abandon” Virginia. God still used him as a Christian, in that when Lee said it was “over”, the civil war was over (many wished to continue a guerrilla campaign). It is likely no other person commanded as much respect in the south so that the war would have been truly over. Yet what seems at odds to me in Lee’s thinking, is that he did not embrace HEBREWS 11:13-16 until after the war (Arlington cemetery came from the Union’s desire to desecrate Lee’s families land…Lee had owned the land of present day Arlington cemetery…Lee’s legacy, to me, is how God will use us, even when we get it wrong. Hebrews 11:13-16 All these died in faith, without receiving the promises, but having seen them and having welcomed them from a distance, and having confessed that they were strangers and exiles on the earth. For those who say such things make it clear that they are seeking a country of their own. And indeed if they had been thinking of that country from which they went out, they would have had opportunity to return. But as it is, they desire a better country, that is, a heavenly one. Therefore God is not ashamed to be called their God; for He has prepared a city for them.

Alyson Dreyer We are to obey the laws of man unless they contradict the laws of God. The law says we are able to defend ourselves from bodily harm, God agrees. I believe we help the police if we can stop an act of violence. I carry a gun daily because it is a right we enjoy in the US and especially Texas but I would never draw that gun until I was on the loosing side of a physical battle. At that point I would do everything I could to preserve my life. Good topic.

Christopher Dupre Not that we are under the law still, but the Law’s treatment of self defense in the Bible gives us a glimpse into God’s mind on the subject, as well. Christians need to take what we know Scripture says and apply it to what Scripture does not address directly. It’s just common sense and follows the law of Justice to stop sin where we have power to do so.

Wendyl Leslie Spot on, Christopher!